992 GT3 vs. FL5 Type R

[BuntaTypeR]

Ive chased GT3 RSs at Buttonwillow before. With an experienced driver behind the wheel, that car will absolutely spank my Type R. At the time I was only on a Phearable tune, and even then I could keep up with one through the corners, because the drivers didn’t seem fully familiar with the track and waved me by.

Realistically, when comparing the cars in the turns, the Porsche is faster. Its aero, layout, and tires are on another level. Any moment I was able to stay with it was really just driver vs. driver, not car vs. car. The GT3 RS is engineered to dominate.

Meanwhile, the Type R will start melting its tires by lap 4–5 because of the FWD design. And if you’re running stock cooling, it’ll overheat (275F or more) after about five laps once the weather hits 85°F or higher. Without the right cooling mods, heat becomes a limiting factor.

On the other hand, the R is incredibly cost effective to run. Maintenance is way cheaper than a GT3 RS, and the practicality is unmatched, i can load all my tools and gear in the car without needing a truck or trailer. With a GT3 RS, you can drive it to the track, but space is very limited, so most owners still need support pick up truck/flat bed.

And here’s the truth:

• It’s one game $ when you buy a Type R.
• It’s another game when you mod a Type R.
• And it’s a whole different game $$$$$$ when you race a Type R.

But with a GT3 RS, it’s a completely different financial universe:

• It’s one $$ game when you buy a GT3 RS.
• Another $$$ game when you mod a GT3 RS.
• And an entirely different $$$$$ game when you race a GT3 RS.

The cost escalates really fast. That’s why I personally would never track a GT3 RS (good thing , im too poor to afford it). The risk and expense are just too high. But massive respect to the people who bring them out because that car is an absolute monster. The layout, aero, power, weight, and PDK make it one of the best track weapons ever built.

At around $450K OTD in California and that’s before maintenance and insurance, it’s an incredible machine, just not something I’d ever want to risk on a track.

 

[AspecR]

Allow me to drop my $0.02 from the perspective of someone that sold these bad boys to multiple GT3, GT3 RS, GT4 and GT4 RS owners.

I’ve sold 5 FL5s to Porsche GT car owners. 1 person actually bought 1 as a bet from his friend that I sold one too. The others were bought as toys to keep miles off their GT cars. Every single owner couldn’t believe what the FL5 was capable of, for the money. Is it better than a GT car? Absolutely not, but in the right hands they can make a GT car driver sweat.

Like a few responses have stated, many of my former clients have parked their GT cars in favor of tracking their FL5s since it’s so much cheaper to deal with if something goes wrong.

 

[m3bs]

Every single owner couldn’t believe what the FL5 was capable of, for the money. Is it better than a GT car? Absolutely not, but in the right hands they can make a GT car driver sweat.

Like a few responses have stated, many of my former clients have parked their GT cars in favor of tracking their FL5s since it’s so much cheaper to deal with if something goes wrong.

100%. Another aspect to me is the fact that the CTR is fun and engaging to drive at normal speeds, yet doesn’t feel at all out of place on the track. My GT4 doesn’t come alive without risking my license on the road. The jury is still out on operating costs….

 

[Rhorn]

All of the above is why I’m putting my GT4 up for sale.

Yeah I'm actually considering getting a Cayman GT4 but its up between the C8 Z06 or a Camaro ZL1 1LE. Big downside to the Z06 is that theres no manual and it bit heavy. The GT4 is lightweight and a manual but from what I've seen alot is that the front strut suspension is annoying as it the camber constantly changes during mid corner. C8Z06 would definitely me more for to drive.

I really would like a mid engine car so that I'd get another new driving dynamic to experience. Still not sure what to get but I think next year I'll get more serious.

Either way, Im definitely keeping the CTR and my BRZ. Very good platforms for what they offer and now that the cooling situation has resolved thanks to WOT, the CTR is really solid platform if you can live with FWD. I just really love the low consumable cost they offer. Big fast cars like the C8Z06 are fun but they just so expensive to track.

 

[m3bs]

Yeah I'm actually considering getting a Cayman GT4 but its up between the C8 Z06 or a Camaro ZL1 1LE. Big downside to the Z06 is that theres no manual and it bit heavy. The GT4 is lightweight and a manual but from what I've seen alot is that the front strut suspension is annoying as it the camber constantly changes during mid corner. C8Z06 would definitely me more for to drive.

I really would like a mid engine car so that I'd get another new driving dynamic to experience. Still not sure what to get but I think next year I'll get more serious.

Either way, Im definitely keeping the CTR and my BRZ. Very good platforms for what they offer and now that the cooling situation has resolved thanks to WOT, the CTR is really solid platform if you can live with FWD. I just really love the low consumable cost they offer. Big fast cars like the C8Z06 are fun but they just so expensive to track.

My GT4 replaced a ZL1 1LE. It was fast, and made the right moves, but I never got comfortable with the size and weight.

 

[Shingo Shoji]

I had a passionate conversation recently with a friend about this very thing. Porsche used to be the attainable dream car. You worked really hard, went to college, worked your way into middle management, senior management maybe, and now you can treat yourself to a Porsche. No chance that's a given today. Now your dream car is priced like a luxury artifact. An entry-level 911 starts deep into six figures, and once you add the enthusiast essentials: proper seats, wheels, Front Axle Lift System, Sport Chrono, you’re staring at a number that feels more like a down payment on a house.

The brand has shifted from “driver’s cars for enthusiasts” to “luxury goods for high-net-worth clients.” I attend the events on occassion and the environment speaks to how they're positioned in the market and it's palpable. And don't get me started on the new clientele. I can't go 5-minutes without running into PE guy and his buddies.

SUVs bankroll everything, so Porsche can price sports cars however it wants. And the options? A masterclass in monetizing desire. Paint, seats, trim—everything that makes a Porsche special costs thousands…each. Then add the scarcity play. GT cars are basically auction items the moment they're allocated to dealerships, and even used models have inflated beyond reason. The cars are still phenomenal no doubt, maybe the best in the world, but they’ve been financially engineered into collectibles instead of attainable passions.

Bottom line: Enthusiasts didn’t walk away from Porsche. Porsche climbed a ladder and pulled it up behind them.

This was a brilliant articulation of how I’ve felt for a while about Porsche. They are priced to be irrelevant for enthusiasts. They are as relevant as a yacht and therefore hard to get interested in.

I like the comparison in the original post though. I kept a modded M2 honest on the track and he was so suprised. I’m sure it must surprise Porsche GT owners for whom the FL5 is as relevant as a home mortgage.

 

[Rhorn]

My GT4 replaced a ZL1 1LE. It was fast, and made the right moves, but I never got comfortable with the size and weight.

Yeah I'm starting to realize sadly theres really no lightweight sports car other than a Porsche and Lotus.

Even the older pre 992 911s have the same problem that the GT4s have with the tires washing out because they aren't a multilink front suspension.

 

[TypeRD]

Yeah I'm starting to realize sadly theres really no lightweight sports car other than a Porsche and Lotus.

Even the older pre 992 911s have the same problem that the GT4s have with the tires washing out because they aren't a multilink front suspension.

There are options out there, you just have to think outside the usual choices a little bit, like the Ariel Atom.

 

[m3bs]

Even the older pre 992 911s have the same problem that the GT4s have with the tires washing out because they aren't a multilink front suspension.

Lots of cars, including the ZLE and our Civics, do just fine with struts up front. The real problem on the GT4 is struts in the rear, which results in not only camber change, which is manageable, but toe change as well. Inexcusable on a $200K GT4 RS, IMO. They get by with it by making it so stiff that wheel travel is limited. Name another car that uses rear struts…. There are some, but very few.

The first time I took the CTR on track I was amazed at how well behaved it was at the limit in comparison.

 

[Clark_Kent]

Yeah I'm actually considering getting a Cayman GT4 but its up between the C8 Z06 or a Camaro ZL1 1LE. Big downside to the Z06 is that theres no manual and it bit heavy. The GT4 is lightweight and a manual but from what I've seen alot is that the front strut suspension is annoying as it the camber constantly changes during mid corner. C8Z06 would definitely me more for to drive.

I really would like a mid engine car so that I'd get another new driving dynamic to experience. Still not sure what to get but I think next year I'll get more serious.

Either way, Im definitely keeping the CTR and my BRZ. Very good platforms for what they offer and now that the cooling situation has resolved thanks to WOT, the CTR is really solid platform if you can live with FWD. I just really love the low consumable cost they offer. Big fast cars like the C8Z06 are fun but they just so expensive to track.

BLUF: On paper, double wishbone > strut. In the GT4, though, it’s effectively a draw for almost every real-world driver.

I wouldn’t leap to that conclusion (bold section) without firsthand experience near the car’s limits. The GT4 dramatically outperforms what its suspension layout suggests. If you judged it by diagrams alone, you’d expect a double-wishbone car to steamroll it. But Porsche’s tuning, alignment strategy, chassis stiffness, and damper quality elevate the strut far beyond expectations. Porsche simply packages and executes a strut better than almost anyone else.

At true pro-level pace, the strut will become the limiting factor before a well-designed double wishbone system (think Lotus Exige/Emira or C8 Z06). But for 95% of drivers, the GT4’s setup is so good that those limitations never surface.

If you have direct experience that contradicts this, feel free to take it with a grain of salt.

 

[ctechauto]

This is an interesting thread. I dont think they can be compared with all things considered, especially stock for stock. There is some splash of subjectiveness here too

There is a reason I track my 981 Cayman S (not a GT4 but has GT4 bits and a ton of upgrades over even GT4 stuff) over my FL5.

Don't get me wrong, the FL5 is fantastic but its just not the same, especially the subjective "feeling" of the car

Newer cars, regardless of how good/fast they are on the track just tend to feel more muted. I'd rather track my EK9 than the FL5. Again, subjectiveness.

I get it, consumables for the FL5 is cheaper than a Porsche generally. (unless its a stock 3RS or something with stupid tire sizing, then you'd have to spend money on 19s or even go all out for Cup spindles+brakes to put 18s, same with GT4 Clubsport stuff).

But stock for stock all things considered, no where even comparable, especially to the GT Porsches. They are just fast out of the box. Objectively, at my local track a good driver in a 992 GT3 stock besides pads and fluids is right around a 2:00 mark. FL5 even a good driver with a ton of mods (power, cooling etc) is around 2:03-2:06 (which is around a Cayman GT4 time, impressive but again not stock vs stock). 992s are VERY fast.

5x+ the cost to get you 3-6s faster? Thats where most people draw the line which is where most of the people here stand. I get it, but it veers into subjective territory quick.

 

[ctechauto]

Lots of cars, including the ZLE and our Civics, do just fine with struts up front. The real problem on the GT4 is struts in the rear, which results in not only camber change, which is manageable, but toe change as well. Inexcusable on a $200K GT4 RS, IMO. They get by with it by making it so stiff that wheel travel is limited. Name another car that uses rear struts…. There are some, but very few.

The first time I took the CTR on track I was amazed at how well behaved it was at the limit in comparison.

Porsche will never let the Cayman outshine their halo car, regardless what trim level it is. Its always been nerfed, and you put in 992 wishbones on a 982 4RS, it will outshine it.

 

[a c i d.f l y]

I did the driving experience at COTA at the beginning of the month. For context, I’ve never been on track before. This was my first time. I did it in the GT4 RS, an amazing car to say the least. It was fast, but I didn’t feel it was faster than the Type R, probably because when I watch the video on the back straight, I hit 140 or 145, but I feel the Type R could be up there. This doesn’t take into account the fact that if I can afford one, I’ll definitely buy one. But now I’m happy with the Type R and the flaws that it has. In my opinion, Porsche is the best supercar out there. Sure, Ferrari, Lamborghini, and all that are a nice flex, but Porsche is the top of the mountain for supercars. I will keep my Type R and enjoy it, but hopefully, one day I can do at least one lap at COTA in the Type R. That is the other part of my dream. For now, I’m happy to say that the GT4 RS PDK was amazing and felt really good on track.

How much did this run you? I've been very interested in doing something like this, but it all looks pretty cost-prohibitive.

Also, I'm 13 serial numbers after you, R-28385. Where in Austin or the surrounding area are ya?

 

[Evox787]

How much did this run you? I've been very interested in doing something like this, but it all looks pretty cost-prohibitive.

Also, I'm 13 serial numbers after you, R-28385. Where in Austin or the surrounding area are ya?

It was 700 with the insurance and the video with the pictures it was the full throttle package, for two laps on the GT4 RS. It’s a dream come true I did a lap on a F1 track and on a Porsche could not ask for more. I’m from Killeen is a little of a drive to COTA but was worth it that day.

 

[miles_away]

You may also be interested in checking out the Porsche Experience Center. For $750 I was able to have 90min in a 992 S with an instructor. This was early last year at their Los Angeles location. I thought it was well worth the money.

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