Catastrophic Engine Failure

[hammeredsole]

Personally, and this is just my opinion, get it fixed and trade it in. The FL5 is a really outstanding handling car, but the engine is characterless and underpowered. I would get your value out if while it's still a hot commodity. Strike while the iron is hot so to say. It will always be a front wheel drive car, and right now prices on proper sports cars are going to where they were 5 or 6 years ago. Your opportunity to get something truly weekend worthy and a commuter at the same time are very good. Or, depending on your life situation, just bank the money during the recession and get a good buy in on future 7% compound interest.

I'm not a financial advisor, but the forums are awash with people fully indebted to both the banks as well as Type R identity, so you are sort of barking up the wrong tree here.

A secondary opinion is to wait for the forthcoming ADX which could very well have a K20C1 powered AWD Type S option.

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[optronix]

Personally, and this is just my opinion, get it fixed and trade it in. The FL5 is a really outstanding handling car, but the engine is characterless and underpowered. I would get your value out if while it's still a hot commodity. Strike while the iron is hot so to say. It will always be a front wheel drive car, and right now prices on proper sports cars are going to where they were 5 or 6 years ago. Your opportunity to get something truly weekend worthy and a commuter at the same time are very good. Or, depending on your life situation, just bank the money during the recession and get a good buy in on future 7% compound interest.

I'm not a financial advisor, but the forums are awash with people fully indebted to both the banks as well as Type R identity, so you are sort of barking up the wrong tree here.

A secondary opinion is to wait for the forthcoming ADX which could very well have a K20C1 powered AWD Type S option.

Can't tell if trolling, honestly. This take is so bad. Especially on a Type R forum lol. But I'll take the bait.

Before I'd even get into asking what specifically you'd recommend for a "proper sports car" that is "truly weekend worthy"... how are you going to trash the engine and then tell the OP to buy a heavier vehicle in a completely different class with (presumably) the same engine?

Are you actually suggesting that an as-yet-to-be-revealed compact SUV is a better "proper sports car" than a Type R?

 

[Stan23]

Personally, and this is just my opinion, get it fixed and trade it in. The FL5 is a really outstanding handling car, but the engine is characterless and underpowered. I would get your value out if while it's still a hot commodity. Strike while the iron is hot so to say. It will always be a front wheel drive car, and right now prices on proper sports cars are going to where they were 5 or 6 years ago. Your opportunity to get something truly weekend worthy and a commuter at the same time are very good. Or, depending on your life situation, just bank the money during the recession and get a good buy in on future 7% compound interest.

I'm not a financial advisor, but the forums are awash with people fully indebted to both the banks as well as Type R identity, so you are sort of barking up the wrong tree here.

A secondary opinion is to wait for the forthcoming ADX which could very well have a K20C1 powered AWD Type S option.

IMO, right around 300hp/300tq is the sweet sport for a relatively light weight car, and primarily street/canyon car. It's much less satisfying to constantly 'hold back' a higher HP car on the street. One of my other cars is a G80 M3, and rarely can I or should I even remotely exploit its limits on the street.

I also never get the argument of "why did you pay $50K for a civic when can buy a used _____ car with a lot more performance!" I don't understand that because a lot of us value buying a new car with new warranty. I'm also a fan of the 911, and debated selling my M3 for a 2018 991.2 Carrera S, but when I went to look at it - I was really put off trading in my owned from new M3 and my OCD levels of care, to someone else's used car. Just my opinion of course.

Either way, you're in a Type R enthusiasts forum, of course we're all here because we like the car for what it is, and not what it isn't?

 

[Clark_Kent]

Personally, and this is just my opinion, get it fixed and trade it in. The FL5 is a really outstanding handling car, but the engine is characterless and underpowered. I would get your value out if while it's still a hot commodity. Strike while the iron is hot so to say. It will always be a front wheel drive car, and right now prices on proper sports cars are going to where they were 5 or 6 years ago. Your opportunity to get something truly weekend worthy and a commuter at the same time are very good. Or, depending on your life situation, just bank the money during the recession and get a good buy in on future 7% compound interest.

I'm not a financial advisor, but the forums are awash with people fully indebted to both the banks as well as Type R identity, so you are sort of barking up the wrong tree here.

A secondary opinion is to wait for the forthcoming ADX which could very well have a K20C1 powered AWD Type S option.

I'm not following the logic here, at all. You bought a GRC, sold it in short order, and then couldn't pass up an opportunity to trash it. Then bought an FL5, it was great for a short time until it wasn't. That car also was sold relatively quickly, and now tossing dirt on it as well? I don't know what to make of this take other than it's a misguided one.

The issue isn't the cars. The issue is expectations are misaligned with reality. These are great sub-$50k ($40K for the GRC) cars. These are the best cars around at the price point and many will argue they punch above it. I don't know what more these cars are supposed to do for you. If you want a car that will blow you away, you need to spend more money, and a lot of it. In most cases, at least a 2-3x multiple.

 

[optronix]

IMO, right around 300hp/300tq is the sweet sport for a relatively light weight car, and primarily street/canyon car. It's much less satisfying to constantly 'hold back' a higher HP car on the street. One of my other cars is a G80 M3, and rarely can I or should I even remotely exploit its limits on the street.

I also never get the argument of "why did you pay $50K for a civic when can buy a used _____ car with a lot more performance!" I don't understand that because a lot of us value buying a new car with new warranty. I'm also a fan of the 911, and debated selling my M3 for a 2018 991.2 Carrera S, but when I went to look at it - I was really put off trading in my owned from new M3 and my OCD levels of care, to someone else's used car. Just my opinion of course.

Either way, you're in a Type R enthusiasts forum, of course we're all here because we like the car for what it is, and not what it isn't?

^Interesting point about the 911, I'll take the opportunity to go off-topic for a bit. This might just be your OCD. A 991.2 C2S is a spectacular sports car that I'd argue is in a completely different league as a driver's car over the G80 M3. And the Porsche CPO warranty is as good (or better) than a new car warranty. Porsche owners take great care of their cars (mostly) too... I'd revisit that if I were you. Too much redundancy between an ITS and an M3, but a 911 would be an ideal augmentation.

Find a good one with low miles and don't look back.

 

[menikmati]

Personally, and this is just my opinion, get it fixed and trade it in. The FL5 is a really outstanding handling car, but the engine is characterless and underpowered. I would get your value out if while it's still a hot commodity. Strike while the iron is hot so to say. It will always be a front wheel drive car, and right now prices on proper sports cars are going to where they were 5 or 6 years ago. Your opportunity to get something truly weekend worthy and a commuter at the same time are very good. Or, depending on your life situation, just bank the money during the recession and get a good buy in on future 7% compound interest.

I'm not a financial advisor, but the forums are awash with people fully indebted to both the banks as well as Type R identity, so you are sort of barking up the wrong tree here.

A secondary opinion is to wait for the forthcoming ADX which could very well have a K20C1 powered AWD Type S option.

Well that's a hot-take I never expected.

 

[Stan23]

^Interesting point about the 911, I'll take the opportunity to go off-topic for a bit. This might just be your OCD. A 991.2 C2S is a spectacular sports car that I'd argue is in a completely different league as a driver's car over the G80 M3. And the Porsche CPO warranty is as good (or better) than a new car warranty. Porsche owners take great care of their cars (mostly) too... I'd revisit that if I were you. Too much redundancy between an ITS and an M3, but a 911 would be an ideal augmentation.

Find a good one with low miles and don't look back.

A 991.2 S is still a used car, CPO warranty or not. It still has 6 years of wear and tear. I spent time and miles in the 991.2 S and while it is a great car, it was very unrefined compared to my G80 which it would replace. I didnt find the driving experience to be in a "different league." I actually find the steering feel and chassis feedback to be much better on my lowly S2000 AP1.

The G80 is a completely different experience than the FL5 and I enjoy them both in completely different ways. Also the 911 is not the end all of cars and I've had them in the past, and while I do have an 992 allocation, I'm still on the fence about it. My buddy keeps harping for me to grab a 991.2 GT3, but see my comments again about a used car.

 

[AspecR]

Personally, and this is just my opinion, get it fixed and trade it in. The FL5 is a really outstanding handling car, but the engine is characterless and underpowered. I would get your value out if while it's still a hot commodity. Strike while the iron is hot so to say. It will always be a front wheel drive car, and right now prices on proper sports cars are going to where they were 5 or 6 years ago. Your opportunity to get something truly weekend worthy and a commuter at the same time are very good. Or, depending on your life situation, just bank the money during the recession and get a good buy in on future 7% compound interest.

I'm not a financial advisor, but the forums are awash with people fully indebted to both the banks as well as Type R identity, so you are sort of barking up the wrong tree here.

A secondary opinion is to wait for the forthcoming ADX which could very well have a K20C1 powered AWD Type S option.

This is a wild take lol; "but the engine is characterless and underpowered," characterless I agree, underpowered? said no one ever. Getting rid of a car with 185 miles makes zero sense at this time, not a single person would buy this used one, when a new one would definitely be cheaper.

Go from a Type R to an ADX??? I don't see the logic.

 

[optronix]

A 991.2 S is still a used car, CPO warranty or not. It still has 6 years of wear and tear. I spent time and miles in the 991.2 S and while it is a great car, it was very unrefined compared to my G80 which it would replace. I didnt find the driving experience to be in a "different league." I actually find the steering feel and chassis feedback to be much better on my lowly S2000 AP1.

The G80 is a completely different experience than the FL5 and I enjoy them both in completely different ways. Also the 911 is not the end all of cars and I've had them in the past, and while I do have an 992 allocation, I'm still on the fence about it. My buddy keeps harping for me to grab a 991.2 GT3, but see my comments again about a used car.

Yeah to each their own. I couldn't be bothered with a G80, I don't view it as a sports car even though I realize it's very capable. So yeah, "refined" could be a word for that... I just can't reconcile having a G80 and an FL5. Just doesn't make sense to me unless you have fuck you money to take the G80 when you don't feel like shifting gears. Which apparently you have lol.

And no, if you have an S2K I don't see a point to the 911 as a driver's car augmentation to an FL5. Other than that it is SEVERELY underpowered relative to a 991.2 especially... so not really much of a comparison but I want an S2K too so I get the appeal, and do think there's a bunch of redundancy there too. Didn't bother to look at your sig or I probably would have just held my tongue.

So I guess if you want a "fun to drive" car with 4 doors and a manual... and a "fun to put your foot down" car with 4 doors (probably an automatic?)... and a "pure driver's car/open air experience"... you've got a pretty solid stable.

The "used car" thing let's just agree to disagree. Your G80 is also technically a used car. I don't get your logic, to me it's all in your head. Not that there's anything wrong with that, just to each their own (i.e, that's a "you" problem lol).

 

[Stan23]

Yeah to each their own. I couldn't be bothered with a G80, I don't view it as a sports car even though I realize it's very capable. So yeah, "refined" could be a word for that... I just can't reconcile having a G80 and an FL5. Just doesn't make sense to me unless you have fuck you money to take the G80 when you don't feel like shifting gears. Which apparently you have lol.

And no, if you have an S2K I don't see a point to the 911 as a driver's car augmentation to an FL5. Other than that it is SEVERELY underpowered relative to a 991.2 especially... so not really much of a comparison but I want an S2K too so I get the appeal, and do think there's a bunch of redundancy there too. Didn't bother to look at your sig or I probably would have just held my tongue.

So I guess if you want a "fun to drive" car with 4 doors and a manual... and a "fun to put your foot down" car with 4 doors (probably an automatic?)... and a "pure driver's car/open air experience"... you've got a pretty solid stable.

The "used car" thing let's just agree to disagree. Your G80 is also technically a used car. I don't get your logic, to me it's all in your head. Not that there's anything wrong with that, just to each their own (i.e, that's a "you" problem lol).

My G80 Is 6MT. The used car thing is obviously a preference as i've already mentioned above...

Apologies to the OP for derailing your thread. To add my take, i'd ask if I can get a replacement car, but not expect it. Let them repair the car, and move on. Hopefully a year from now, the whole ordeal wouldn't even be a blip on your radar!

 

[hammeredsole]

Can't tell if trolling, honestly. This take is so bad. Especially on a Type R forum lol. But I'll take the bait.

Before I'd even get into asking what specifically you'd recommend for a "proper sports car" that is "truly weekend worthy"... how are you going to trash the engine and then tell the OP to buy a heavier vehicle in a completely different class with (presumably) the same engine?

Are you actually suggesting that an as-yet-to-be-revealed compact SUV is a better "proper sports car" than a Type R?

Because I just don't think the K20C1 is a great engine. It makes pretty "mid" power with mushy midrange, is not emotional at all, and massively limited by being front wheel drive. I really thought it was a great chassis, but for me bikes and cars are 80% about the engine experience. This isn't the Honda that got me hooked, and personally it did nothing for me. I nearly wept when I sold my 12k mile FA5 a few years ago, and I was over the FL5 in about 4 minutes.
I think it would be a great engine in something that is "sporty", but doesn't pretend to be a sports car, or in a FR layout in a new S2000 it would probably be pretty good. However, for Type R money, you could have a Porsche 981, 996, 997, 987, any Miata, Fox body with a Coyote swap, lots of M3/M5 options, and lots of other options that would actually be fast fucking cars. Hell, for a few dollars more you could buy a pretty good condition NSX.
Don't get me wrong; I think the Type R is great, it's just that for the money..... it's not that good. What's really absolutely insane to me is that people are paying ADM and financing at high interest rates. This car has just become a symbol of stupid, and no matter how much I liked it, it was still a FWD car with an image problem and a high price/poor value.

These are just my opinions, and you know what they say about that. I just know that my FL5 got all sorts of attention from the wrong sort of crowd, and coupled with the overall driving/ownership experience, I just felt like it was a waste of money. As I've written elsewhere, I traded for a CRV Hybrid and I think it's a better car, for a fat wad of money less.

FL5: Razor sharp handling, really truly impressive. Outstandings seats. No class all clout. Mehhh engine.

 

[optronix]

Because I just don't think the K20C1 is a great engine. It makes pretty "mid" power with mushy midrange, is not emotional at all, and massively limited by being front wheel drive. I really thought it was a great chassis, but for me bikes and cars are 80% about the engine experience. This isn't the Honda that got me hooked, and personally it did nothing for me. I nearly wept when I sold my 12k mile FA5 a few years ago, and I was over the FL5 in about 4 minutes.
I think it would be a great engine in something that is "sporty", but doesn't pretend to be a sports car, or in a FR layout in a new S2000 it would probably be pretty good. However, for Type R money, you could have a Porsche 981, 996, 997, 987, any Miata, Fox body with a Coyote swap, lots of M3/M5 options, and lots of other options that would actually be fast fucking cars. Hell, for a few dollars more you could buy a pretty good condition NSX.
Don't get me wrong; I think the Type R is great, it's just that for the money..... it's not that good. What's really absolutely insane to me is that people are paying ADM and financing at high interest rates. This car has just become a symbol of stupid, and no matter how much I liked it, it was still a FWD car with an image problem and a high price/poor value.

These are just my opinions, and you know what they say about that. I just know that my FL5 got all sorts of attention from the wrong sort of crowd, and coupled with the overall driving/ownership experience, I just felt like it was a waste of money. As I've written elsewhere, I traded for a CRV Hybrid and I think it's a better car, for a fat wad of money less.

FL5: Razor sharp handling, really truly impressive. Outstandings seats. No class all clout. Mehhh engine.

Ok. You replaced it with a CRV Hybrid and think it's a better car.

Great context.

edit- And for anyone still paying attention, the OP has long checked out of this thread. There are no rails anymore; dude had 2 posts and both were in this thread...

 

[ABPDE5]

Because I just don't think the K20C1 is a great engine. It makes pretty "mid" power with mushy midrange, is not emotional at all, and massively limited by being front wheel drive. I really thought it was a great chassis, but for me bikes and cars are 80% about the engine experience. This isn't the Honda that got me hooked, and personally it did nothing for me. I nearly wept when I sold my 12k mile FA5 a few years ago, and I was over the FL5 in about 4 minutes.
I think it would be a great engine in something that is "sporty", but doesn't pretend to be a sports car, or in a FR layout in a new S2000 it would probably be pretty good. However, for Type R money, you could have a Porsche 981, 996, 997, 987, any Miata, Fox body with a Coyote swap, lots of M3/M5 options, and lots of other options that would actually be fast fucking cars. Hell, for a few dollars more you could buy a pretty good condition NSX. Don't get me wrong; I think the Type R is great, it's just that for the money..... it's not that good. What's really absolutely insane to me is that people are paying ADM and financing at high interest rates. This car has just become a symbol of stupid, and no matter how much I liked it, it was still a FWD car with an image problem and a high price/poor value.

These are just my opinions, and you know what they say about that. I just know that my FL5 got all sorts of attention from the wrong sort of crowd, and coupled with the overall driving/ownership experience, I just felt like it was a waste of money. As I've written elsewhere, I traded for a CRV Hybrid and I think it's a better car, for a fat wad of money less.

FL5: Razor sharp handling, really truly impressive. Outstandings seats. No class all clout. Mehhh engine.

You will always get more car for your $ buying used... that doesn't mean buying a new car is a waste of $. You're paying for a warranty and fresh ownership experience -- whether or not that is worth it can vary. I've had good and bad experiences buying used cars, and you don't really know what you're getting until you get it. A car with an engine swap (fox body with a Coyote)? That's an entirely different animal. And, you're not getting a pretty good condition manual NSX for "a few dollars more", nor are you getting a good condition manual 997 for FL5 money (unless you take a chance on a high mileage 997.1, and that could run you an extra $25k overnight).

I agree the K20C lacks the excitement of older NA Honda K / B series motors, but I have to disagree with some of your points here... mushy mid-range? The strength of the motor is the mid-range; it's missing top-end output (mostly d/t the tiny turbo). And, I wouldn't say it makes mid power, either. It's certainly competitive with, if not better than, any other contemporary / currently available 4-cyl on the market, both in OEM and aftermarket form. (No, it's not going to compare to 6 / 8 cylinders with 1.5-3x the displacement... but that's a given.)

Additionally, you're all over the place with your arguments here. You claim the issue with the FL5 is that it has excellent handling but falls short in the engine department, but then you recommend an MX-5, which has excellent handling... but offers less in the engine department than the FL5. You claim the K20C is a "mehhh" engine, but then suggest the engine would be good in an FR layout / new S2000... which would do nothing to change the character of the engine (if your gripe was with FF, then an FR alternative would make sense, but if your primary gripe is that the engine is "not emotional at all", putting it in a FR layout won't fix that). You deride the FL5 for not being fast, suggesting alternatives that "would actually be fast fucking cars", but then you offer up a number of suggestions that are slower (and certainly some that are much quicker, too). You claim you can't get over driving an FF and that an emotional engine is 80% of the driving experience for you, but you prefer a hybrid CRV, which (while available w. AWD) is based on an FF platform with a less emotional engine (and then continue to praise the FF FL5's "razor sharp handling").

Don't get me wrong: you're certainly entitled to your opinion, and many of your points have merit in isolation, but everything you just put together ends up being pretty contradictory / all over the place, and a lot of your used car alternative valuations are way off-base.

It feels like your major sentiment here is really just "don't get me wrong; I think the Type R is great, it's just that for the money..... it's not that good." But, as others have pointed out... $45k for a Type-R is actually just where the car market is at, in general. An MX-5 Club is $40k; a GRC is $40k, etc.

 

[optronix]

Let's call a spade a spade. I've never been one to mince words.

"Hammeredsole" is a salty ex-owner that REPLACED HIS TYPE R WITH A CRV and has thoughts he likes to share.

I think we can mostly agree that his opinions don't fall far from pure troll territory.

I totally missed the "fox body coyote swap". GTFOH.

 

[Stan23]

Let's call a spade a spade. I've never been one to mince words.

"Hammeredsole" is a salty ex-owner that REPLACED HIS TYPE R WITH A CRV and has thoughts he likes to share.

I think we can mostly agree that his opinions don't fall far from pure troll territory.

I totally missed the "fox body coyote swap". GTFOH.

I've been on car forums since dsm.org days (1995 or so) and i've seen guys like that before. They sell the car for whatever reasons after a short stint of ownership, but yet always have 1 foot in the door to 'discuss' and to justify why they sold their car.

I welcome all discussion - good or bad, I just ignore all the noise and move on.

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