Spying on you?

[blueroadster]

Your phone is always spying on you. It doesn't need the car connected. I won't be surprised if Google and other Apps sell speed data to insurance companies. Airplane Mode disables most of them. I'm fine not talking on the phone while driving and I normally know we're I'm going without GPS.

True that your phone is always spying on you. Tech companies including cellular providers know exactly where your phone is, how and when you use it, where it travels at any given time, etc. using embedded sensors communicating over various communication links (e.g., cellular, Wifi, Bluetooth, etc). Some of that information is used to inform traffic maps in navigation software to show congestion that is convenient to know.

The key difference is understanding identifiers used and communicated by devices. Cell phones use an IMEI and IMSI to connect to cellular networks. Without connectivity and unlike the TCU, your phone does not have access to the data communicated across the vehicle's CAN bus nor does it even know the VIN of the vehicle that you happen to be driving at that particular point in time. Unattributable data (i.e., not associated with a VIN) is not of much value to insurance companies as it cannot be directly tied to a specific vehicle and driver.

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[blueroadster]

Totally agree, if you really need to be incognito you shouldn't even carry a cell phone but it's the game of plausible deniability. See if a car reports the data, sure you can say I wasn't driving but ultimately as the car owner you're insurance payment will reflect that because it's associated with the car.

Data will always be collected so IMHO, one should be cognizant of what is collected, how it is collected and manage it to their own level of comfort. Those attempting to go incognito also raises other suspicion flags. A vehicle's VIN is associated with the actual owner but so is the license plate number that is constantly read by license plate readers and CCTV cameras.

A cell phone is different, you can say you were a passenger in a friend of a friend's car, or even that the phone was lost....there's no way to confirm the travel data it picked up was you. That's why IMHO, even if Waze was selling data which guaranteed they are, they'd have a fairly hard time confirming who it's associated with on an individual level. You'd need to be a criminal with active police involvement for them to build a case. Just speculation, I could be wrong.

Agree for the most part but confidence at the individual level increases over time based on collected pattern of life behaviors. For example, you don't have to save your work or home addresses anymore for navigation purposes because the software already characterized your pattern of life and made a calculated estimate/determination regarding the location of home and work.

Anyway, to me Google is more interested where you go, not how fast you get there so I live with that privacy tradeoff because having Waze for speed traps is much more useful than the loss so that google can serve me a McDonald's ad because it's next door to where I am.

For Google I feel the same way and agree however, Google will also sell their data collected about you to third parties that have different data collection sets to aggregate. Again, I believe in simply managing/manipulating personal data collected to one's own level of comfort. I celebrate my birthday every month at various restaurants throughout the year and appreciate the free meal or dessert.

 

[SilverRocket]

Data will always be collected so IMHO, one should be cognizant of what is collected, how it is collected and manage it to their own level of comfort. Those attempting to go incognito also raises other suspicion flags. A vehicle's VIN is associated with the actual owner but so is the license plate number that is constantly read by license plate readers and CCTV cameras.


Agree for the most part but confidence at the individual level increases over time based on collected pattern of life behaviors. For example, you don't have to save your work or home addresses anymore for navigation purposes because the software already characterized your pattern of life and made a calculated estimate/determination regarding the location of home and work.


For Google I feel the same way and agree however, Google will also sell their data collected about you to third parties that have different data collection sets to aggregate. Again, I believe in simply managing/manipulating personal data collected to one's own level of comfort. I celebrate my birthday every month at various restaurants throughout the year and appreciate the free meal or dessert.

Reading your two responses, we are very much alike. Personally I don't care that they gather my data as long as they meet 3 criteria:

1) They are transparent on what/how they collect
2) They are upfront about who they share it with
3) I can actively turn it off or circumnavigate it if I need the privacy

The more we go forward however the harder all three are to achieve.

Ultimately I wouldn't care at all if the system actually worked but in this day and age it's all about profits. The insurance company doesn't care if you're actually safer and less of a risk than 99% of drivers out there, if you regularly do 10mph above the speed limit on the highway you'd get thrown into the same risk bucket as someone doing that same speed in an old shit box with blown out shocks and bald Chinese brand tires. I'm also sure it's not sending road conditions, weather and traffic density data along with that +10mph. They don't care because they get to charge you higher premiums which is why like in Soviet Union, I feel the need to pretend and play along just enough while not actually doing so. I believe the saying was I pretend to work and they pretend to pay me.

Before I stand too long on my digital soap box I'll end with this thought. I really feel like we need license levels in North America where a person who demonstrates their capabilities behind the wheel would have a higher tier license with some latitude to exercise more personal judgment as opposed to offloading the critical thinking to lines and road signs like an NPC. [/rant]

 

[blueroadster]

Reading your two responses, we are very much alike. Personally I don't care that they gather my data as long as they meet 3 criteria:

1) They are transparent on what/how they collect
2) They are upfront about who they share it with
3) I can actively turn it off or circumnavigate it if I need the privacy

The more we go forward however the harder all three are to achieve.

Ultimately I wouldn't care at all if the system actually worked but in this day and age it's all about profits. The insurance company doesn't care if you're actually safer and less of a risk than 99% of drivers out there, if you regularly do 10mph above the speed limit on the highway you'd get thrown into the same risk bucket as someone doing that same speed in an old shit box with blown out shocks and bald Chinese brand tires. I'm also sure it's not sending road conditions, weather and traffic density data along with that +10mph. They don't care because they get to charge you higher premiums which is why like in Soviet Union, I feel the need to pretend and play along just enough while not actually doing so. I believe the saying was I pretend to work and they pretend to pay me.

Before I stand too long on my digital soap box I'll end with this thought. I really feel like we need license levels in North America where a person who demonstrates their capabilities behind the wheel would have a higher tier license with some latitude to exercise more personal judgment as opposed to offloading the critical thinking to lines and road signs like an NPC. [/rant]

Agree on the way of thinking and your reply. Too much intrusion on individual lifestyle so one should manage accordingly.

 

[blueroadster]

Adding details for those concerned about potential apps bleeding information about their vehicle when a phone is connected. You can use a proxy (e.g. Charles) to monitor connections and communications. Free apps typically include monetization APIs that broadcast. Paid apps typically reward the developer directly for their efforts.

 

[clasby53]

Reading your two responses, we are very much alike. Personally I don't care that they gather my data as long as they meet 3 criteria:

1) They are transparent on what/how they collect
2) They are upfront about who they share it with
3) I can actively turn it off or circumnavigate it if I need the privacy





Smart points in this thread. Phones really are relentless data collectors—knowing our moves, habits, and even speed—thanks to IMEI, IMSI, Wi-Fi, Bluetooth, and positioning services . But you're right, it's not the same as sharing vehicle data tied to a VIN through a car’s TCU. It’s about controlling what you can—turning features off, using airplane mode, maybe even checking apps with a proxy like Charles, as mentioned . By the way, on a lighter note—when life takes you off-grid for a bit, having fax with free trial https://comfax.com/reviews/free-fax/ bookmarked has saved me in a pinch. Remote life, meet modern convenience.

Thanks for information!

 

[Another Motorist]

A fl5 owner exclaimed I should remove the tcu. They were leaving the gas pump as I pulled in. Here I am in this thread seeing what this thing is about.

Will remove it soon but carplay will stick around because I have family/friends/myself that use for spotify or google maps.

Wonder if at some point there'll be enough unplugged from the matrix that they'll do something. Nah...

Honda1: Hmm we're seeing a steady rate of those unplugging from the matrix
Honda2: Negligible, we have much more still to feed on and many more will come

Also only seems to be a problem with GM spies. Anyone with issues from Honda spies?

 

[Superhatch]

A fl5 owner exclaimed I should remove the tcu. They were leaving the gas pump as I pulled in. Here I am in this thread seeing what this thing is about.

Will remove it soon but carplay will stick around because I have family/friends/myself that use for spotify or google maps.

Wonder if at some point there'll be enough unplugged from the matrix that they'll do something. Nah...

Honda1: Hmm we're seeing a steady rate of those unplugging from the matrix
Honda2: Negligible, we have much more still to feed on and many more will come

Also only seems to be a problem with GM spies. Anyone with issues from Honda spies?

I am one of the unplugged and no issues with Carplay at all.

We only knew about GM because they got caught. I'm not going to risk my insurance rates hoping that Honda of America always does the right thing.

 

[TypeRD]

I am one of the unplugged and no issues with Carplay at all.

We only knew about GM because they got caught. I'm not going to risk my insurance rates hoping that Honda of America always does the right thing.

The skeptic in me says “Honda has motivation to NOT do the right thing, because it’s a way to make money thru the back door to help offset the tariff costs going out the front door.”

 

[Mawfuqqa]

Just took this mawfuqqa out today

People mention I “ may “ void warranty, lose some car/infotainment functions and eluding that I’m paranoid lol. Basically calling all of us here and those considering this paranoids

Also does anyone else have that indentation in 2nd picture? Noticed it before I began unplugging from the matrix

Has anyone upgraded that tiny central speaker? I couldn’t even tell it was functioning, had to adjust sound direction around the front and left to right to barely hear it going.

 

[blueroadster]

Congrats on removing the TCU...You did good. A thief would quickly do the same if they wanted your car anyway.

Sounds like ignorant minions without a clue that relish podium speaking time. Ask them to elaborate on how FL5 infotainment functionality would be impacted and vehicle warranty voided upon TCU removal. Then ask...What direct benefit is offered to the customer by integrating a persistent monitoring device on their vehicle in the first place tracking usage post sale?

All things considered, I understand why the TCU was added but applaud Honda for making it removable without negatively impacting other systems.

 

[jtlctr]

Just took this mawfuqqa out today

People mention I “ may “ void warranty, lose some car/infotainment functions and eluding that I’m paranoid lol. Basically calling all of us here and those considering this paranoids

Anyone who considers this an act of paranoia can go read plenty of articles on how telematics info is potentially being sold to insurance companies, who can then increase your rates accordingly.

 

[Mawfuqqa]

Oh they do relish podium speaking time... Made a mistake of making one of my TCU discussions on reddit. One guy thought it was traction control unit. No, just no...

This is the majority of those who don't bother to question/keep an open mind/stay blinded by the light and like being viewed by private eyes, they're watching you because they're "not doing anything wrong"

Unfortunately can lead a horse to water but can't make it drink situation. Some will look into it and decide to remove or leave it alone. Though judging by the bs comments I got they already are defensive/offensive and are already set in their ways. Therefore the thought of removing the tcu or listening to anything about it shut off already.

 

[jtlctr]

Oh they do relish podium speaking time... Made a mistake of making one of my TCU discussions on reddit. One guy thought it was traction control unit. No, just no...

This is the majority of those who don't bother to question/keep an open mind/stay blinded by the light and like being viewed by private eyes, they're watching you because they're "not doing anything wrong"

Unfortunately can lead a horse to water but can't make it drink situation. Some will look into it and decide to remove or leave it alone. Though judging by the bs comments I got they already are defensive/offensive and are already set in their ways. Therefore the thought of removing the tcu or listening to anything about it shut off already.

Lol, I think I posted a video clip of this exact scene in Terminator somewhere in this thread.

 

[Superhatch]

Bump for new members.

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