What did you pay for your FL5?

[ElDuder]

Yup, exactly why I thought it was bizarre that everyone thought 20 person list, 3 cars a year means 7 year wait. Those 20 people are each probably at least on 3-4 lists.

I appreciate the willingness of people to be beta testers. I personally never purchase a first model year car so they can work the kinks out with updates in the following model years.

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[Gillie]

FRS/BRZ's were going for as high as 7k over MSRP back in 2013, but by 2016 I got mine for 3k under MSRP.

Got mine for 2k under in 2014. Don't think it'll happen with this car but I think we can get close to MSRP with some wait.

 

[Toprarnen]

Got mine for 2k under in 2014. Don't think it'll happen with this car but I think we can get close to MSRP with some wait.

Were you in LA at the time as well?

 

[Doublestack00]

I appreciate the willingness of people to be beta testers. I personally never purchase a first model year car so they can work the kinks out with updates in the following model years.

Technically this chassis has already been our for a year.

 

[Kuhal]

I think people should also take into consideration regional variations. 58k in one city might seem vastly higher or lower than another. There's also demand considerations. Go to a place like Boston and you'll see very few sedans/sports cars relative to Miami or Atlanta -- it's actually incredible how few there are in some areas after being in ATL for so many years -- the demand means dealers know they can find buyers for higher ADMs.

 

[itsovr9k]

The prices will almost certainly come back to MSRP (eventually). Current market conditions are substantially different than 2017-2020. That being said, there were multiple opportunities starting in Q4 2018 / Q1 2019 to buy a FK8 at MSRP, so it didn't take too long In the last cycle.

Compared to the launch of the FK8 CTR we have:

• Substantially higher interest rates
• More market competitors (Hyundai N products, Corolla GR, etc, more aggressive / fun Golf R with arguably better value for $ / Used CTRs)
• CTR has higher price compared to last gen (23% more exp than 2017 model and 13% than 2021), and aside from design does not provide a notably different / improved driving experience.

Supply of course matters and may be the ultimate determining factor. Price coming back to MSRP will hinge on how production volume compares to the FK8.

When the 2017s came out, a 10k adm on a 35k car, with taxes and fees might be 50k OTD financed at a 3%, which is ~54k inclusive of interest. Still a lot, but more reasonable given the fact that it was the first CTR to the US, the driving experience, and resale value.

The same scenario now...44k with 10k ADM, taxes and fees, maybe 60k OTD financed at 6%, which is 70k inclusive of interest. That is an absurd amount of money to pay for a FWD Honda Civic. Effectively 30% more to have the same experience.

If you have the cash and want to ball out, that's your right , but IMO there are certainly better cars and car combos (Such as a S2000 / Miata / Gen 1 BRZ / 996 911 + Used FK8) to spend your money on for that price.

 

[Doublestack00]

Agreed, I paid MSRP for my FK8.

 

[Kuhal]

IMO there are certainly better cars and car combos (Such as a S2000 / Miata / Gen 1 BRZ / 996 911 + Used FK8) to spend your money on for that price.

Good thing I got a miata as well! I got mine with a whopping 2.8% interest rate in 2021. Right now I could sell my 1.5 year old Miata for more than I bought it for.

But you're also making a bit of a weird comparison, of course people can get more bang for their buck on used cars, but on new cars you'll be running into similar issues as the FL5. The cars you cited are also not the same type of car. A BRZ is not like a CTR or a GR Corolla. And then, of course, 2023 911 is gonna be just a smidge pricer than 70k haha.

People have different priorities with money, but when comparing costs its often good to keep the variables similar. Looking at new high-performance vehicles -- especially ones that aren't purely two-seater sports cars which can't often be used as a daily -- you're running into a lot of the same issues the new FL5 and GR Corolla are having.

 

[Doublestack00]

Good thing I got a miata as well! I got mine with a whopping 2.8% interest rate in 2021. Right now I could sell my 1.5 year old Miata for more than I bought it for.

But you're also making a bit of a weird comparison, of course people can get more bang for their buck on used cars, but on new cars you'll be running into similar issues as the FL5. The cars you cited are also not the same type of car. A BRZ is not like a CTR or a GR Corolla. And then, of course, 2023 911 is gonna be just a smidge pricer than 70k haha.

People have different priorities with money, but when comparing costs its often good to keep the variables similar. Looking at new high-performance vehicles -- especially ones that aren't purely two-seater sports cars which can't often be used as a daily -- you're running into a lot of the same issues the new FL5 and GR Corolla are having.

MSRP no car is a better bargain, at 10-25K ADM there are MANY cars that are a better bargain.

 

[Kuhal]

MSRP no car is a better bargain, at 10-25K ADM there are MANY cars that are a better bargain.

At 54k price point there's not a ton of new vehicles that are significantly better bargains without starting to get into different car categories or much higher prices. I guess a base model CT4 is what, 62k? Though, ain't nobody buying the base Blackwing (the one I test drove was at $76k base). Once you get into the used market that's a different animal.

 

[itsovr9k]

Good thing I got a miata as well! I got mine with a whopping 2.8% interest rate in 2021. Right now I could sell my 1.5 year old Miata for more than I bought it for.

But you're also making a bit of a weird comparison, of course people can get more bang for their buck on used cars, but on new cars you'll be running into similar issues as the FL5. The cars you cited are also not the same type of car. A BRZ is not like a CTR or a GR Corolla. And then, of course, 2023 911 is gonna be just a smidge pricer than 70k haha.

People have different priorities with money, but when comparing costs its often good to keep the variables similar. Looking at new high-performance vehicles -- especially ones that aren't purely two-seater sports cars which can't often be used as a daily -- you're running into a lot of the same issues the new FL5 and GR Corolla are having.

Your position here is not surprising given the fact you have already decided to buy the car with ADM .

From my perspective, driving enthusiasts (not just car enthusiasts) will buy cars (and value them) based on the experience they provide.

So I don't see it as a weird comparison. It's simply taking a step back and thinking about the types of driving experiences you could have for the money.

FYI, I wasn't comparing a BRZ to a CTR (Or a GRC for that matter), I was stating that you could potentially own both a BRZ and an fk8 Civic type R, for the same price as FL5 with ADM.

Also I was referring to a 996 911 (from 1999 -2004) which you can find nice examples of between 20-35k.

 

[Kuhal]

Your position here is not surprising given the fact you have already decided to buy the car with ADM .

Yea, no sweat off my back. If people aren't willing to pay even 5 or 10k adm then they'll have to wait or not get one.

I actually did try to find a used FK8 in decent condition in my area. It was slim pickings on that front and the one I did find was going for a hefty price. I don't know where you're finding these cheap FK8s, but any with sub 100k miles are $34k-40k used near me; a used car for near MSRP or more. That would leave a whopping 14k for that BRZ.

 

[Bonito]

Yea, no sweat off my back. If people aren't willing to pay even 5 or 10k adm then they'll have to wait or not get one.

I actually did try to find a used FK8 in decent condition in my area. It was slim pickings on that front and the one I did find was going for a hefty price. I don't know where you're finding these cheap FK8s, but any with sub 100k miles are $34k-40k used near me; a used car for near MSRP or more. That would leave a whopping 14k for that BRZ.

I briefly considered an FK8 but in the ATL area any decent one is priced at roughly FL5 MSRP. New gen car with 0 miles or last gen car with 30-40k miles isn't a hard choice for me lol

 

[ChiefJeef]

6k ADM for my boost Blue FL5. No additional fees. Within the price range i set for myself.

 

[Kuhal]

I briefly considered an FK8 but in the ATL area any decent one is priced at roughly FL5 MSRP. New gen car with 0 miles or last gen car with 30-40k miles isn't a hard choice for me lol

Yea, there's no way anyone's getting an FL5 at MSRP in Atlanta when you can barely get an FK8 for the FL5 MSRP. Maybe if you're best friends with the dealer or they're feeling super nice? I wouldn't doubt 5k adm as the rock bottom any would go otherwise.

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