Torque Specs for Aluminum Lug Nuts

[renesis]

Hi,

Here is what's been going on. I installed a new set of wheels (Apex ML-10RT's) along with a new set of Rays Dura Nuts about a month ago. The nuts were originally torqued to the OEM spec of 94 ft-lb. Drove 50 miles and noticed one loose nut on the right rear and re-torqued it to 94. Drove another 50 miles and noticed a few other loose ones on multiple wheels and re-torqued them to 94. Drove 100+ more miles and noticed that a bunch of them were loose. So, I googled and found out that they need to be torqued to ~103 ft-lb according to the specs on the Rays Dura Nut box. So, I torqued all nuts to 103 ft-lb last night and went out for a quick drive. I made some quick turns and accel/decel to see if any of them would come loose. After ~5 min of drive, I found 2-3 loose ones on each front wheel and 1 on each rear wheel.

Is this normal? I've found that the most common practice for aluminum lug nuts is to torque them to ~85 ft-lb. But Rays recommend 103 ft-lb for M14 size. Have I been over-torqueing them? Is that why they come loose? Should I ditch them and go with steel nuts? Could this be a wheel issue rather than a lug nut issue?

Is there anyone else that has had a similar issue with Rays nuts or aluminum nuts?

Thank you!

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[MoodySara]

I've used aluminum nuts on the OEM wheels. I've torqued them to 94 lbs-ft.
These were 14mm spherical seats to match the wheels.
A couple of questions.
Are you sure the lug seat matches the wheel? Conical, spherical, whatever?
When was your torque wrench last checked for accuracy?

 

[renesis]

I've used aluminum nuts on the OEM wheels. I've torqued them to 94 lbs-ft.
These were 14mm spherical seats to match the wheels.
A couple of questions.
Are you sure the lug seat matches the wheel? Conical, spherical, whatever?
When was your torque wrench last checked for accuracy?

Thanks for your reply.

Yes, I confirmed the lug seat (60 deg conical).

I bought the torque wrench a few years ago and have used it probably less than 15 times. I always keep it unloaded when not in use. Maybe I can get another one and check.

 

[MoodySara]

I'm not familiar with those exact nuts.
Do they say to lubricate them in some way? Sometimes it's just the face, not the threads.
Something is wrong here.
I've never had an aluminum lug nut come loose, even at the track. Porsche used to say to use Never-Seize on the lug face. I don't think they do that anymore.
Borrow a torque wrench and see if the torque seems wildly different from yours.

 

[renesis]

I'm not familiar with those exact nuts.
Do they say to lubricate them in some way? Sometimes it's just the face, not the threads.
Something is wrong here.
I've never had an aluminum lug nut come loose, even at the track. Porsche used to say to use Never-Seize on the lug face. I don't think they do that anymore.
Borrow a torque wrench and see it the torque seems wildly different from yours.

This is what I found online. No mention of any lubrication.

https://www.civicx.com/forum/threads/rays-engineering-dura-nut-lug-nuts-torque-specs.76640/

Even that thread shows conflicting information (103 ft-lb vs. 85 ft-lb)...

I'm going to re-torque all using a brand new torque wrench today and report back.

 

[Chilly613]

I used to use Rays Dura Nuts L37 12x1.5 with my GramLight wheels on my Sport Touring. No issues what so ever, never loosened up on me once. I've never torqued them down more than factory spec. Would definitely check your torque wrench just in case. Possibly switch lug nuts if you keep having issues.

 

[MoodySara]

One more point and then I'll be quiet.

Is it possible that some part of the lug nut is hitting the sides of the hole, preventing it from seating completely?

 

[nawfoo]

Time to go back to oem ones not worth the safety risk.

 

[TypeRD]

Time to go back to oem ones not worth the safety risk.

Agree with that. I understand aluminum is lighter…but if you’re scrutinizing a few ounces per wheel while potentially sacrificing safety, it may be time to step back.

 

[nawfoo]

There's steel and titanium open ended lug nuts. throw those aluminum ones in the trash, maybe its a faulty set or replace them when a brand new set of aluminum ones if you really have to.

 

[renesis]

There's steel and titanium open ended lug nuts. throw those aluminum ones in the trash, maybe its a faulty set or replace them when a brand new set of aluminum ones if you really have to.

This is exactly what I'm thinking right now. If it turns out that my torque wrench is still good, I'm going to get rid of these nuts and get steel ones.

 

[renesis]

One more point and then I'll be quiet.

Is it possible that some part of the lug nut is hitting the sides of the hole, preventing it from seating completely?

I just checked and didn't see anything obvious. The paint or anodized layer of the nut is scratched off where it meets the tapered hole pretty evenly. So, I assume it's making a full contact with the wheel.

 

[renesis]

I'm not familiar with those exact nuts.
Do they say to lubricate them in some way? Sometimes it's just the face, not the threads.
Something is wrong here.
I've never had an aluminum lug nut come loose, even at the track. Porsche used to say to use Never-Seize on the lug face. I don't think they do that anymore.
Borrow a torque wrench and see it the torque seems wildly different from yours.

Tried a brand new calibrated torque wrench. No difference. I guess I just have to conclude that the nuts are somehow defective unless someone proves that the torque spec I've been using is wrong.

 

[AZCWTypeR]

The best aluminum lug nuts are inferior in strength to generic steel lug nuts.

That being said, it's common for highly torqued nuts to relax a bit. The thinking is the stress concentration on thread high spots yields a bit. If repeated torquing doesn't solve the problem, the nuts are too weak. Also torque check when everything is at ambient temperature, since the stud and wheel materials have different thermal expansion rates.

My old Porsche 911 came stock with anodized aluminum lug nuts, but with a very fine thread compared to common nuts. Also the hubs were aluminum or magnesium alloy.

 

[CTR]

Never had issues with mine. I think your torque wrench is off.

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