For those who are running a tune and have emissions inspection.

[jtlctr]

As long as I can revert before smog, it's all good. But if they're going to be able to look at flash counters or checksum that isn't straightforward to verify before going in for a test, that's a headache. At this point others have said as long as you flash back to stock tune and drive long enough through drive cycles to reset obd flags, it's ok. We should know how this goes by now based on other cars, FK8 is hitting 8 years.

I plan on keeping the car, I know others say they sell their cars before it's up for smog. Of course, CA is always a moving target...

I doubt they're looking at flash counters, but they may be looking at the CVN which is the checksum. Both the calibration ID and CVN are available to look at in mode 9 on a scan tool. So, you'd need to know what those numbers are before reflashing to compare later. However, when you flash back to stock with the Hondata, you will get the latest factory software from Honda, not your original version. So, if Honda releases an update, that's the version you will get and it will no longer match what you recorded originally. In any case, returning to stock programming with Hondata should work fine. It did for me.

Another possible option would be to clone your ECU and leave the original alone for inspection. As far as I know, this would work, but I'm not 100% sure about that.

Sponsored

 

[nvtive_b]

This would be one of the times I'm glad I'm in California. We do not have to have emissions testing on brand new cars for 8 years.

True that! haha car will probably be out of my garage before i even have to smog it ? some states like Montana dont even require smog.

 

[Mrjustin81]

True that! haha car will probably be out of my garage before i even have to smog it ? some states like Montana dont even require smog.

Where I live in Ohio, I don’t have to do any type of inspection, smog or otherwise. Some of the vehicles I’ve seen. Yikes!

 

[blueroadster]

Good reason to eliminate the TCU so you control the data shared from your vehicle to the mothership that will turn around and sell your information in a heartbeat. With the TCU connected, all vehicle data and recorded driving behaviors get constantly sent to the mothership regardless of whether or not you use HondaLink. Eventually, that bulk data about your vehicle and how you use it will be sold for pennies to interested buyers. Honda can also use the information to detect if the car was modified simply by comparing values reported based on original design specifications/limitations.

Don't buy the BS from the auto industry where they claim that the data is anonymized. It 100% is not as the VIN is included in the communications and courts have previously ruled that a VIN is considered Personally Identifiable Information (PII). Manufacturers get around that issue by providing Privacy Statements to owners that are an utter joke. Eventually, the bulk data collected from your vehicle and how you use it will be used against you in one form or another in the future. Eventually, states would likely be interested in this data for compliance hidden under the guise of "emissions testing" where the "emissions" from the vehicle are simply not even considered.

The above is a key reason to disconnect/remove the TCU so your car is no longer "connected." Being "disconnected" requires checking for updates using another device and an external USB drive where only a 1 KB JSON file is sent to Honda to check for updates. Here is an example of the JSON file from my car sent to Honda to check for a software update (red question marks added to replace portions of the "deviceID", "timestamp", "inventorySig", "serialNumber" and "managementUnit" sections):

{"deviceData":{"deviceID": "JHMFL5G42RX0?????","manufacturer": "Honda","model": "20 Panasonic DA","locale": "en_US","inventory": {"timestamp": "??????????","inventorySig": "????????????????????????","swInventory": [{"id": "RB_AUTO;;8A500T20 A5;;8A050T20 A5","ver": "77CA-0068-121","name": "8A050T20 A5"},{"id": "RB_AUTO;;8A500T20 A5;;8A070T20 A5","ver": "77CA-0068-121","name": "8A070T20 A5"}],"hwInventory": [{"id": "8A500T20 A5","nodeAddress": "8A500T20 A5","partNumber": "8A500T20 A5","serialNumber": "????????","managementUnit": "????????"}]}}}

Limited information and no live or stored driving behavior reported to the mothership.

I also cloned my factory ECU to revert back to the original programming if ever needed. When that happens, I have heard that reinstalling the factory ECU would result in odd lights being triggered until the car has been driven for some time to clear.

 

[jtlctr]

I’m sure you’re right about the info being used eventually for inspection purposes. I love tapping that little red “1” on the screen and seeing the message “TCU not connected”?

 

[ThunderPigeon]

Took my TCU out a few weeks ago. It also fixed the rattle that I would sometimes get there.

 

[Zone47]

This explains a lot.

Where is the TCU located and how do you remove it?

 

[jtlctr]

This explains a lot.

Where is the TCU located and how do you remove it?

Its super easy. Remove the center dash speaker and it’s tucked under the dash ahead of the speaker area. Two electrical connectors and 2 screws (phillips/8mm socket) and you’re done (or just disconnect it and leave the unit in there).
Understand that this won’t change anything at inspection time if that applies to you, because they’re reading directly from the ECU. Still a good idea for various other privacy reasons though IMO.

 

[Zone47]

Its super easy. Remove the center dash speaker and it’s tucked under the dash ahead of the speaker area. Two electrical connectors and 2 screws (phillips/8mm socket) and you’re done (or just disconnect it and leave the unit in there).
Understand that this won’t change anything at inspection time if that applies to you, because they’re reading directly from the ECU. Still a good idea for various other privacy reasons though IMO.

Thanks, I appreciate it!

 

[zumbooruk]

Thanks, I appreciate it!

note that after removing the TCU, no more updates via wifi or cellular connection to the firmware, you will have to manually check for update and use a USB thumb drive

see this thread for details (page 6 or 7 iirc)

https://www.civicxi.com/forum/threads/spying-on-you.53757/

Did you try using a FAT32 formatted USB drive to then follow the steps to update via USB on the car? If so, a JSON file should have been copied to the drive where you then remove the USB drive, insert it into a computer and upload the JSON file via usb.honda.com.

If there is an update available, download the ZIP file and save it in the "HondaSoftwareUpdates" folder. Return to the car, reinstall the USB drive and follow the prompts on the screen to complete the update. After completion, a report is saved as a JSON file and the software is updated on the car. Return to your computer, install the USB drive and upload the JSON report to usb.honda.com.

I am not sure what step failed when you attempted, but give the above a try. I just updated mine via USB without having to reconnect the TCU.

 

[a c i d.f l y]

Fortunately, Texas no longer performs inspections, and only four counties still conduct emissions tests on the OBD2 to confirm the "READY" status of the EVAP and O2 sensors. When I failed my 2017 Civic's inspection after forgetting to turn the O2 sensors back on, I was given 12 days to fix it. I drove home, turned them back on, drove until they indicated "READY," and then went through the inspection shop -- annnnd passed, got my sticker, and drove off. Several miles later, my CEL came on. 2.0 NA high-flow cat problems... they do record inspection passes and fails and report those to CarFax, so it did have that one ding on its record. Oh well. Each year after that, I would drive through while the CEL was off, lol.

Thanks for the reminder to check my OBD2 to ensure my tune hasn't inordinately turned off any sensors on the FL5.

 

[jtlctr]

Fortunately, Texas no longer performs inspections, and only four counties still conduct emissions tests on the OBD2 to confirm the "READY" status of the EVAP and O2 sensors. When I failed my 2017 Civic's inspection after forgetting to turn the O2 sensors back on, I was given 12 days to fix it. I drove home, turned them back on, drove until they indicated "READY," and then went through the inspection shop -- annnnd passed, got my sticker, and drove off. Several miles later, my CEL came on. 2.0 NA high-flow cat problems... they do record inspection passes and fails and report those to CarFax, so it did have that one ding on its record. Oh well. Each year after that, I would drive through while the CEL was off, lol.

Thanks for the reminder to check my OBD2 to ensure my tune hasn't inordinately turned off any sensors on the FL5.

I was so hoping to have the same experience. Got the monitor back on, went through the drive cycles, everything was ready but the inspection machine still spit out the “this car cannot be inspected” message?. Until I had everything verified by Honda themselves, I was boned. Thanks Massachusetts! I’ll bet if they actually put an emissions analyzer in the tailpipe, it would have passed with flying colors with the TSP downpipe, but I had to remove that too for a visual inspection. All that is what I’m hoping to help anyone else avoid.

 

[Zone47]

note that after removing the TCU, no more updates via wifi or cellular connection to the firmware, you will have to manually check for update and use a USB thumb drive

see this thread for details (page 6 or 7 iirc)

https://www.civicxi.com/forum/threads/spying-on-you.53757/

Ok, thanks. It will just be good to get the nanny off my back. That explains why my insurance doubled. No tickets, no claims but the rate went through the roof in 6 months. They must have purchased the data and saw that I drag raced it at the track... multiple runs at around 13.7 / 105 mph.

 

[jtlctr]

Ok, thanks. It will just be good to get the nanny off my back. That explains why my insurance doubled. No tickets, no claims but the rate went through the roof in 6 months. They must have purchased the data and saw that I drag raced it at the track... multiple runs at around 13.7 / 105 mph.

This happened to me too! When I got my insurance premium bill this year it had more than doubled. I called my agent immediately and he was all “Well, it’s a fast car so….” I wasn’t having that so I bitched a little until he said he would see what could be done. He then got back to me with a quote from another insurer that was less than half the price. He seemed pissy about having to switch the policy, which I took to mean he was profiting off the original price increase. Anyhow, I’ve always wondered if it was because of that dirty rat under the dashboard.
I recommend you shop around to get a better price.

 

[a c i d.f l y]

Ok, thanks. It will just be good to get the nanny off my back. That explains why my insurance doubled. No tickets, no claims but the rate went through the roof in 6 months. They must have purchased the data and saw that I drag raced it at the track... multiple runs at around 13.7 / 105 mph.

Your insurance rates likely have nothing to do with anything you specifically did, or even your car. Insurance companies are abusing inflation rates and "disasters" to inflate rates artificially. I was a zero-accident, no-ticket driver, and my rates on my 2017 Civic doubled in 2021. I changed providers, who then also doubled my rates 2 years later. I had to change providers again. They have no rewards for loyalty. And there are no humans to negotiate with anymore, either. It's all automated to **** you for the profit machine. Insurance is a scam.

Sponsored